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Tournament for the #1 Tactician Tittle
Okay so this idea came up from this topic:"Why leaderboard sucks." http://www.battleforces.com/node/945
I would like to know who is the #1 tactician in Battleforces
Here is what I propose:
- take the top 5 players and match them against each other in a series of H2H games.
- each player should play another one at least 3 times so that means a total of 8 games per player (if you guys don't think that this is statisitcally viable we could go to 12 games per player but i don't think it would make much of a difference).
If more folks are interested we could start this tournament with elimination according to the leaderboard rankings:
1st Elimination - players #15 thorugh #5 compete for their winner
2nd Elimination - winner of the 1st elimination competes with players #1 thorugh #4.
The #1 player of all time tourney should relies a lot on data from the leaderboard. If were saying leaderboards suck, then this doesn't really lend itself to supporting that argument.
I'm game but I think I'm #6 today - not in the top 5. I've been oscillating between #3 and #9 for months now.
My money is on Burg though - anyone want to wager?
>My money is on Burg though - anyone want to wager?
No takers here.
"The #1 player of all time tourney should relies a lot on data from the leaderboard."
>> true, it takes a lot of skill to be #1 player on the leaderboard. Bromley plays very well and he is both a skilled diplomat and tactician and he does deserve the title of being #1. ON THE OTHER HAND, nguyen plays dirty, plays against a lot of noobs and he is also a high ranking player.
i would really like to know who is the best tactician in this game without the factor of diplomacy (making noobs attack the stronger play), team games and custom map games which often do not provide fair starting postions.
@Barka, I am pretty sure that you will make it to the tournament since Shaka is out of the picture
nguyen taught me this game so I feel funny reading mateus' article.
I'm very new to the game, but being armed with just a few keynotes nguyen taught me, I am about to win the head-to-head tournament playing against top players like InGeneral, Barka, they are good players, but I won because they made basic strategic mistakes which nguyen taught me how to exploit. I guess nguyen is far ahead of other top players, it's pity he quited too soon before reaching the top.
My money would be on Bromley or Burg (having played them both H2H before).
I have no chance as I make lots of basic strategic mistakes.
If Bromley and Burg would play, I would yield my spot to ams so he can demonstrate his superior ability.
nguyen won a game as recently as a couple weeks ago so not sure what you mean he quit ams? BTW, nguyen has chickened out of both H2H tournaments so far. Tough to judge just how far ahead of the rest of us he is given that he's scared to enter the H2H tournies.
Who said I quit? I said I was busy so I can't play seriously for a few weeks.
To say I'm far ahead of other players is a lame statement, ams, don't make me worried with such statements.
InGeneral, I remember that I defeated you all 3 times in a row in your favourite heads up game setup. In all those games, you had a common strategic mistake, which allowed me to defeat you in a game which you had a fair lead in income and number of troops. Most of heads up games I play, I see people making the same mistake.
ams, I'm happy to know you exploited it successfully in the tournament. But don't misunderstand me, it's not basic, it's not easy to recognize by most people. What I taught you were all advanced concepts. If I am to quit, I will share them in the forums, but not for now, so don't tell anyone else please.
I don't have a favorite heads up game scenario, and I only remember twice when you were new to the site, you beat me good two in a row. I remember in one of them I made a really stupid rookie type mistake, and never recovered. The other you used a tactic I did not anticipate, and it worked, and I never recovered. I don't remember having a big income and troops lead and losing to you... maybe that was so painful I've blocked it from memory. lol I have always said I think you are an excellent tactician nguyen. I find some of your diplomatic tactics distasteful (another trait you have coached ams on), but of course diplomacy is not a part of the H2H game.
Anyway, glad to hear you're not quitting. Will you play mateus' idea? I think if it's done I've decided to play after all. Your son can earn his way in, he's far superior to everyone else so it won't take him long.
A little google provided your word: "nguyen has slapped me around 3 times in 1v1 games, I would pay to watch a bromley v nguyen matchup. ". It's when I was a new player at that time, low ranking, still exploring the features. Now I'm experienced, so of course I'm not afraid of playing you. I was looking for heads up tournament to play, I regret I couldn't attend the current one. It's lucky for me my trainee was successful, and he credited me for the training, good job, buddy.
I remember the paying to watch you guys play comment. Very good. They were speed games on a Saturday night, right? I don't remember 3 games but I had quite a few pints that night.
Not sure why you or anyone else would be scared to play me, I'm not really very good. But regardless, you did pass on both H2H tournaments despite getting a personal invite to each. I figured you just don't like H2H games much. I hope you can make the next one.
BTW, your trainee hasn't won it yet, although earlier he denied you coach him it's nice he now gives you the proper credit.
BTW nguyen, don't remember you mentioning, how do you know ams anyway?
ok so far we got Barka and perhaps inGeneral signed up for the tournament. I am hoping Bromley will be up for it as well. I would like it to be strictly high level tournament between perhaps the top 5 or 6 players. there is no point of making this tournamnet if top players refure to play.
I get it now. Sounds like a tournament of champions! Hope you get the players to commit. Sounds cool. Probably would be good for the BF community as a whole.
I'm in too.
I guess the barrier to join should be top 10 or top 15 or top 20. Top 5 is not enough since Shaka and Burg is not very active, and may not join.
Burg has been on a bit of a break from BF, but may be convinced to return for such an event. He's not planning to be gone permanently anyway.
alright i will send a message to Burg. I hope Bromley will join too.
so we would hopefully have the following players:
1. Bromley86 (????)
2. InGeneral
3. nguyendinhnam
4. Burg (????)
5. Barka (unless Praytrade is an active player - ive never seen him play)
I played praytrade twice not so long ago, I won both games. Around that period, he persistently join standard heads up map. I guess he loves heads up games.
Sorry Mat. I haven't payed a game for a month and am only back for an A&A hit.
ok, you could join in and play a couple of unranked games for a week or two weeks.
Nothing to do with points Mat. If it's a measuring contest, I've already said that Burg's better than me.
If I tried a little harder, I'm sure I could work in a joke involving 7/8ths :) .
yeah but it's a game against not only Burg but other guys as well. while Burg might be better against you he might not do as splendid job against inGeneral or others. the winning player is the one that gets most wins overall and not against a single players.
Wow. Such high praise from Barka and Bromley, obviously two of Battleforces' best. Never played Bromley head-to-head, but *long* ago did manage to contribute to a few of Bromley's rare losses in team/free-for-all games. The fact that I specifically recall my personal victories in those games speaks to my high respect for Bromley and his excellent play.
Thanks for commenting in my absence, InGen. Yeah, I'm on a break but not gone for good or anything, and while something like this tourney is tempting, I don't think I have the time right now. Without our #1 Bromley in the mix it wouldn't be legit, anyway. Kind of like another head-to-head tourney but with a smaller field.
I am curious as to what format you're proposing. I've yet to see a head-to-head format where I believe that both sides start with an equal chance to win the game (I posted my thoughts on InGen's 1st tourney, but didn't play in the 2nd). Standard world head's up with full forces comes close, but I still have a significant preference there, and the first few turns are pretty much a chaotic mess regardless. Maybe custom maps offer a solution here, or a flavor I haven't tried (standard world w/ 1 inf?)...
--Burg
P.S. Trying not to take the bait too much, but really, ams, I hope a language barrier is responsible for some of your arrogance. I'm impressed with your wins in InGen's tourney and would agree you're positioned as the favorite, but you've hardly won it yet. And to suggest that you and Nguyen know a secret that eludes the rest of the top players is, well, ridiculous. Obviously you've learned some elite moves and play styles, and you know how to punish your opponents' mistakes. That makes you (and Nguyen) elite, but hardly greatly superior to everyone else. I mean, look at InGen (whose humility matches his skill)--he's won 168 ranked games and is 3rd on the leaderboard despite the fact he shows absolutely no concern for leaderboard points or protecting his rank. He just plays for fun, pretty much anytime, anywhere, and is willing to make a few mistakes along the way. The Battelforces gods save us if he ever sacrifices some of the fun and truly devotes himself to playing mistake-free!
well there is no hurry i assume, so I could make a custom map, perhaps 30 by 30 with perfectly balanced income/zones/starting forces. players would be choosing zones and they would be required to choose accordingly to certain map rules to make the game 100% fair and balanced. since the gameadmins provided us with custom map making abilitites, this would be one of the few occasions where games would be 100% fair and nothing would count towards the win but the players skill.
again, Bromley there is not hurry so if you let us know when you gonna be ready we can just make the tournament (it would probably take me a week or so to make the map). and as Burg mentioned you would be a crucial part of it, without your presence there is no point of making one.
mateus,
If you're looking to create a well-balanced map, you might take a look at this for inspiration:
http://impgames.com/images/Crucible%20map.png
Crucible, sweet. :-)
We definitely need a map like that, if not for heads up, then for 6 player games.
Why battle? We do that all the time. Let's do something different. Let's vote! I've nominated Burg and he's got a couple of votes. Any other nominations for the best player?
I struggled for a bit on a vote, but rather than agonizing over whether it's Bromley or Burg, I realized when it's that close it probably doesn't matter that much which way I go. So I flipped, it came up heads, and thus my vote is Burg.
If the contest is hubris though I will definitely need to change my flip to be between two others who have posted in this thread.
And I'm pretty sure that coin flipping super close decisions is not a basic strategic error, sorry Brom it just came up Burg this time.
Fair enough. I'd voted for him anyway and that was not just because I'm humble (and handsome, to boot!).
Burg is the current leader with 3 out of 3 votes. If you need confirmation of his skill, check out the way he managed to round his score off to 14,000!
is he a robot from star treck?
> If you need confirmation of his skill, check out the way he managed to round his score off to 14,000!
Lol, Bromley. Yes, the secret to both my 14,000 score and my general success is, in fact, one and the same: luck. :-)
I actually started my break when my score was 13,987, but got sucked into one last game by PeavyBob since I'd commited to being on his "dream team" vs. "challengers." Lo and behold, the win there scored me exactly 13 points (and an amused smile).
This will probably fly over the head of many of our non-American gamers, but I have to say this voting for the #1 tactitian thing reminds me of the college football BCS system: amusingly flawed and open to endless debate.
good comparison
Sorry, I've been gone for a while. I haven't had a reliable connection in a while. I'd love to have a tournament like this, but it isn't feasible to declare the winner the #1 tactician, since different players are better at different maps. (Hex Armada is my forte)
IMO, the best general strategist I've played against is burg, though I have yet to play Bromley in a 1v1. Even so, that doesn't mean he'd come out on top in this tournament.
On a side note, ams, I've played nguyen several times in both multiplayer and h2h games, and I've won every time. He's a great strategist but you idolize him WAY too much.
addo is in fossor , Ego mos iuguolo vos